Current 1894 Quality


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:04 pm
I ordered the Winchester Model 1894 new Miroku built Sporter Model today. I looked at a whole pile of lever actions out there. From Marlin to Henry to Rossi to Uberti to others. And I sure looked at a LOT of different calibers form .22 magnum to Marlin .204. The .357 Magnum models are selling pretty well. I finally decided that although I shoot .357 magnum in a great Ruger Super Blackhawk that I'd rather get the 30-30. The rifle I ordered has a 24" barrel. Since i have quite a few new Model 70s of just about the same overall length I decided that I'd like the checkering and could deal with the long barrel. The short rifle new 1894 was probably my next choice. The Sporter is about $1.150 with most every dealer who can get them and there are not many out there. A new run will be coming in October but will only fill half of the existing orders. Time to buy for me. The Cabela's 1894 Special only came in 38-55 with ONE lone 30-30 being produced. I had an option on that rifle but passed on it. The current 1894 Sporter is beautiful and soon I will own one!
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:20 pm
Congratulations Davey.....I like your choice.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:25 am
The curved butt plate is the one reservation I have about this. For me building a few back up stocks with our stock building equipment....the curved stock and fitting the curved plate is something we have NOT DONE anything except black powder Kentucky and Pennsylvania long rifles. And fitting those was something we would be reluctant to tackle today. Now we mostly would send out black powder stocks as select blanks only and leave the customer or a long rifle company to do all the rest.

The "shotgun style" butt plate has always been our preference! I regard it as easy to work with, functional and easy to stand leaning on the butt plate. I have never had much experience with the curved butt plate. That includes how they feel at the shoulder when shooting. I am not talking about recoil as I have decided on the 30-30 which I regard as very mild in recoil.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2015 10:04 pm
I MIGHT pick up my new Sporter 1894 24" barrel 1894 tomorrow. The dealer I ordered it through seems almost reluctant to get it sold from his store. They are not displaying the rifle though. It is in the new gun box, etc.. I did look carefully at it. Great workmanship. Plain white box that supposedly all new Winchesters come in???? Is this questionable marketing or what. It was built in Japan (Miroku) in April of 2015....this year.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2015 10:55 am
Never did understand that move...
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2015 2:58 pm
The plain white box is unusual for a manufacturer. Box script and logos are free advertising as the contents are transferred around. Don't know about the new models, however a Winchester with original box usually brings the seller a few more dollars.

When I was in broadcasting, I would use plain white boxes to replace lost or damaged original vacuum tube boxes.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 10:05 am
The Winchester Model 1894 Sporter built by Miroku weighed in at 7 3/8 pounds. Winchester told me that the white boxes now are standard. Again that is how my rifle came. Both Winchester Arnold, Missouri and Morgan Utah confirmed this. Still find that very hard to believe. Seems like a blunder to me. The rifle quality though is superb and all other details are perfect. I can't believe a logo box will not reappear soon. The logo box adds more to the rifle perceived value. Hard to believe a $50.00 75th anniv. Red Ryder Daisy BB Gun comes with that nice a box and Winchester's looks like a replacement box??

Now to see if I can shoot worth a darn with the Buckhorn rear sight stock rig or if I am going to have to add a peep sight. The tang area safety looks fine to me, actually quite slick by my reckoning. But it does rule out a Tang rear peep sight. I will NOT use a scope on this rifle if at all possible but all reviews I see on the new 30-30 say it is very accurate that way. I do NOT want a side mounted rear peep sight.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:14 pm
Since you have confirmed the plain boxes are factory, the only thought I have is profit. Plain white boxes probably shave off production costs. As a Winchester fan, I do not appreciate the change.

First, hand-off manufacturing to Japan.

Second, plain white generic box.

What's next?
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 2:27 pm
I do NOT think the white box from Winchester can possibly stay that way for very long. It as any one who has sold a rifle knows bad for customer confidence. In my experience shooters, collectors, and almost any buyer (including a dealer buying to resell like Kittery Trading Post in Maine, or LL Bean) would rather have new in box unfired or at the very least a like new rifle with the original Winchester Box. How long it is going to take to get a very negative customer reaction I am uncertain, but it won't take a full year for this cost saving measure to be replaced.

I might just be one of the least likely to be sold on needing the Winchester Logo box as other details mean a lot to me......but I was surprised enough to do a thorough checking on why no original Winchester Logo box. If I were in that business i would be putting some marketing on the box as well. The Nichol's Cap Gun Factory in Texas was adamant about box design and marketing. So is Daisy in Rogers in Arkansas. The total number of 1894 Winchesters was something over 7 million. I actually would like to know that number if any of you might know what it was somewhat recently. One would think at the current rate that total number (the most of any rifle ever) will not grow much larger.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 11:07 am
Not too surprising to me...American industry is on the wane no matter what they produced...and Japan is running a close second with the American attitude.

I fear for where this country is heading...3rd world comes to mind. The fall of Rome...and her Republic.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 2:32 pm
Many early product boxes were art. Some remain so as others have moved away to less expensive packaging. Too bad.....most everything I grew up enjoying are no longer worthy of concern.

Early comic books, gold and silver age, are an examples of art. Not anymore.

I'll not get into my reasons as the subject is too subjective.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 3:53 pm
Question to veterans like Red Ryder and Shooter 13......Any experience with Skinner Peep Sights? I sure INTEND to use the stock sights for my new Winchester 94 Sporter. I will stick with them if possible. I also will make darn sure they can be put back on if the rifle is sold later by one of my family. They sure will have some rifles to choose from and I would think they will sell the surplus. Since my current fleet mostly scoped bolt actions which can hold MOA and they are sighted in based on what the specific rifle was intended for. This Model '94 in contrast was bought almost exclusively due to my passion for western movies and I want it to be as 1894 to 1930s as possible. I am a pretty good shot with iron sights and have done very well just recently with offhand unsupported shooting....but mostly this rifle I admit is pretty much like a walking stick.....portable nostalgia.

Again it is the very first 30-30 I have ever owned. All the Native American rifles I held (four) from Battle of White Bird Plains and Little Big Horn were 1866 Winchesters in my memory, or one was a Henry??? That was in 1970 when I was in the west working with Native Americans every day.

I work in a farming operation that is very diverse and we are building some stuff that is very well done.
I do think American industry is slipping and have seen this sine I was in my 20s have studied our balance of trade and many other details that many could not be bothered with. I did not get to be an Army Colonel without applying myself but it does make you very aware where the USA is heading and our relative productivity.

We have been very concerned with packaging, imagery, and promotion of our work in our business (and have a reputation of helping others whose work we admire) and do think that Your collective comments are both astute and certainly make me think Winchester Owners Forum is on a good track. I have also learned more than a little here and a couple of other similar sites.

Lastly I do admit that the current 1894's are NOT easy to get, quite expensive, and in contrast I have seen a Crazy Horse Winchester 1894 (although he and Sitting Bull had 1866s!) that was beautifully done
and came in a box that was adorned with art work that made me think I needed one of those. Of course I don't need one of those......even the brass upholstery tacks were positioned to hold meaning according to the Lakota Tribesmen. That is a tradition that too seems lost today. I for one think their spirits still linger and enrich our lives.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 6:27 pm
Well Davey, I can't partner with you on scopes and peeps as I have never scoped or peeped a lever. I could probably get to like a tang peep. Some firearms are meant to be enjoyed via iron sights. Levers are the some.

Colonel, 06, I presume, is a kick-ass rank. In the Coast Guard as your know, an 06 is a Captain. Very powerful rank with due respect up and down the chain.

Thank you for your service to what is now an America in trouble.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:07 am
My brother Kermit (named for Teddy Roosevelt's son) was a Coast Guard Captain. Half of his rifles are from Japan like a .257 Weatherby Magnum built by Hoya. He and I own a farm in the Southern Tier of NY.
His homes are Washington and Hawaii. I was only a 06 Colonel for a very short time. Unless one has a rank for three years it reverts to the next lower rank upon retirement. So it really is LT. Colonel in my case. The BEST WORK I ever did was as a Captain. Come to think of it....the awards I won were mostly when I was a SP4!

I have EVERY intention of using iron sights on this 94 Winchester. The tang peep sight is out as the rifle has a nice tang safety which is not very highly rated by many, but I think it is OK. Looks nice.....Still have yet to get the rifle in my possession. I am supposed to pick it up today now.....that keeps getting delayed by my local store. Until I shoot it on our rifle range here at this farm I don't know how it will work for me. I do know my Winchester 9422 was such a problem I finally put a red dot sight on it and then it was a cinch to hit anything out to 50 yards and fast to use. Since my concept with this new rifle is that 1894 to 1930 time frame I need to stay with iron sights. Skinner peep sights for the 94AE are supposed to require not drilling or tapping. If I can get by with the buckhorn I will.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:01 pm
No experience with peep sights Davey...sorry I can't help.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2015 10:21 am
Here are some photos of my new '94 Winchester Sporter 30-30. Also shown in two of the photos is a 1894 1923 built 25-35 with a asking price of $2,400 which comes in about a pound heavier with almost everything else being the same. Shows the Winchester 1894s have shed a little weight over the years. One of the photos shows the cartridges I am using at present. I already know this rifle is accurate! One of the photos shows my local gun dealer in his store holding both 1923 Winchester 94 and this one built in April 2015 in Miroku. Another photo shows the curved rifle style buttplate on the new rifle. Note the straight American Walnut with a oil finish. Every customer there at the store said they would take that stock over a new Browning '81 .308 Lever Action despite the fact that the Browning was less money and a more modern effective caliber.

As much as anything the Browning design looked odd to them and the high gloss varnish stock looked "wrong". Personally I was very impressed with the Browning '81 Lever Action but the very nicely figured stock was not very attractive with the high gloss varnish. Last photo I have posted is detail of the laser checkering 18 lines per inch of the forend. Doing some pretty fancy checkering myself the W on the Miroku '94 Winchester would be by hand pretty close to extremely difficult. Overall I was extremely impressed with my new rifle! I admit I looked at at least 250 Winchesters before I bought this and about 100 Henrys, 30 Ubertis and ten Marlins. I also would like to see the current Winchester "Short Rifle" available in checkered style as well as no checkering like it is now.
Attachments
DSC_8230.jpg
My Local Gun Dealer and my new '94 and a '94 from 1923 in 25-35
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DSC_8226.JPG
The new '94 Sporter 30-30 and the '94 25-35 from 1923 for sale for $2,400
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The Winchester 30-30 cartridges I am using at present
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2015 10:32 am
DSC_8243.jpg
It would be pretty tough to beat the laser checkering on the new '94 Winchester Sporter
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9422 done in the custom shop at New Haven in '73 and the new 30-30.
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The other photos mentioned in my last post. My 1973 Winchester 9422 with a laser red dot sight. And the new '94 Sporter in 30-30, The close up of the curved butt plate and buttstock showing the straight grain American Walnut with nice oil finish. Last photo is the 18 lpi fore-end with the Winchester W, very attractive!
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DSC_8241.jpg
Crescent butt stock and very straight grained walnut with excellent oil finish
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2015 11:20 am
Excellent narrative and pic share Davey. You did good with choosing those Winchesters.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2015 11:43 am
Good post Davey...liked the pics too !!

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2015 5:55 am
One of my next steps with the new '94 Winchester 30-30 Sporter is to lighten the trigger pull. We will do that in house as we are pretty well set up to do most things mechanical, and we do some gunsmithing work already. It is 4.5 pounds approx. now (not measured, inferred from reviews of the rifle) and I will reduce it to 3.0 pounds or a tiny bit less. Once the adjustment is made though it is difficult to add to go back to stock (I Think?) if ever needed if the rifle was sold. Personally I think the rifle COULD have come to the customer that way but lawsuits have pushed it a little too stiff. Marlins I tried were heavier than that.
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